CBS News (MUST-READ!): N.Y. Health Care Workers Revolt Over H1N1 Vaccine
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11 Responses to “CBS News (MUST-READ!): N.Y. Health Care Workers Revolt Over H1N1 Vaccine”
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“Not some “conspiracy theory” rag, or even an obscure alternative media source, but a mainstream report.†This article is clearly not written with the slant of a conspiracy theory, however, your preface of the article smacks of irrational fear mongering. It is correct that this is a main stream report. Perhaps that is why it is well balanced and quotes lay people with no health care training as well as doctors (these types of professionals with medical degrees tend to understand more about health and safety than people who serve food at hospitals).
“Paula Small, a Women, Infants, and Children health care worker (in the nutrition field)… said she will refuse (the vaccine), worried the vaccine is untested and unproven, leaving her vulnerable.†The obvious fact is that Ms. Small is uniformed, which is why healthcare professionals (i.e. M.D.s), not workers in the nutrition field (i.e. lunch ladies), have advised that she receive the vaccine. The vaccine has been proven, year after year and has been tested, just like any other flu vaccine in the recent past. It is true that flu vaccines are approved in an accelerated fashion, but this is out of necessity. The flu strains change every year, and so do the vaccinations. Dr. Susan Donelan said that “most in the medical community see the benefits and safety of the shots and welcome themâ€. I’m not sure what she means by that, but it sounds like the government has brainwashed her.
“This is the most fascistic, totalitarian thing I have seen in some time.†Have you also heard that these same facilities require employees to wash their hands after using the restroom, and they can’t reuse needles, even if they believe it is their personal freedom and civil right to recycle. These types of facilities also waste tons of money sterilizing instruments before surgery, probably because of the sterility lobbyists. I’m sure it has nothing to do with protecting patients from disease. Fascists!
“What the report does not say is that a class-action lawsuit is about to be filed, led by nurses but including others, against the university, the hospital, and the state.†Most would agree that merely the prospect that a lawsuit may be filed is a strong indication of wrong doing. Most would agree that act of filing the lawsuit and actually getting a judgment are mere formalities. Just thinking about planning on filing a class action lawsuit proves that harm was inflicted, that’s just common sense.
“THE FORCED (MANDATORY OR YOU LOSE YOUR JOB!) SWINE FLU VACCINATION IS HAPPENING! It is only just starting, as the “powers that be” test the waters to see how far they can go. If they are successful here, others will follow suit – and it will not end with just health workers!†Thankfully, the illuminati have yet to produce enough vaccine to vaccinate all citizens of our fascist state. There is not enough flu vaccine to go around, that is why at risk groups ( like people who work at hospitals!) are provided with the vaccine.
Vaccinations are not intended to protect individuals, they are intended to protect society as a whole. If you have no interest in protecting your neighbors, you should move far away from civilization, perhaps off the grid where “the man†can’t get to with his mind control.
Health care workers have a responsibility to protect the individuals at their facilities. This story has absolutely nothing to do with the government requiring all citizens to be vaccinated; it deals specifically with a requirement for state health care workers to be vaccinated. This action is meant to limit the risk of the spread of infectious disease. Is it a health care workers civil right to choose whether or not they want to wash their hands? Should doctors be allowed to use bare hands during surgery? Are these civil rights, or are they too intended to limit the spread of disease? I pose these questions for any rational thinkers that may stumble upon this comment, as I am sure some folks just won’t get it.
If you want to share an article, fine. Let people make their own conclusions, don’t muck it up with you conspiracy theorist babble. This article presents valid information and is an interesting observation of an event. That’s what news articles do.
Is my comment sarcastic and ridiculing? Yes, but it wouldn’t have to be if this article was not so asininely prefaced. I’m just trying to keep things balanced.
Very truly yours,
James Lamberti
Posted on 13-Oct-09 at 3:38 pm | PermalinkMr. Lamberti:
Thank you for your extended, thoughtful and…balanced comments. (LOL)
Even were I to agree with all of your comments (which I don’t, though I do agree with some), I want to pose three questions to you.
1. If the H1N1 vaccine is so safe, why were the three companies who produce it given full and perpetual indemnity and immunity from prosecution for ANY harm or death that might arise from the use of the vaccine?
2. Throughout the current swine flu “scare” (i.e., for the past six months or more), the W.H.O., C.D.C., many health experts and many mainstream science-based news reports have continually noted that the regular seasonal flu is far more virulent than H1N1; i.e., it has a higher mortality rate, and thus causes more deaths. Given this, why is the H1N1 vaccine being so heavily and heavy-handedly foist upon ANYONE (including health care workers), while the same is NOT done with the seasonal flu vaccine?
3. Even were I to grant that the H1N1 virus is some ultra-dangerous super-bug that rivals the seasonal flu in its contagiousness and mortality rate (which is simply not true), under what rubrik can you justify the mandatory, FORCED vaccination of ANYONE (including health care workers) against their will, including threatening their jobs? That is one of the textbook definitions of “totalitarian”: “Completely regulated by the state especially..by coercive measures…as an aid to national mobilization in an emergency.”
In addition to the above, what you clearly miss is the timetable here: yours is too short-sighted. True, RIGHT NOW the only people being forced to get the vaccine are health care workers in some places in some states. But history shows that these types of policies get broader with time, particularly in cases of ALLEGED pandemic diseases: i.e., if the disease starts spreading more rapidly than expected, or there is a higher mortality rate than expected, I will bet a dollar to your dime that this policy will broaden to include a much broader swath of the population – including “threats” if one does not capitulate (loss of job, child not permitted to stay in school, etc.). Indeed, the article as much as SAYS that this is the case, when it mentions that other states are watching this case closely to see whether they will join in the FORCED vaccinations.
As well, there will be almost no way to tell whether a person developed the disease as a result of contagion, or from the vaccine itself. And I will bet another dollar to another dime that anyone who suggests that they contracted the disease from the vaccine will be dismissed, and the “powers that be” will use the media to make sure that any such claims are squashed very quickly, and covered up with government-medical propaganda about the “safety” of the vaccine.
Yes, right now it may only be some health care workers. But let’s see where we are two, four, six months from now if H1N1 becomes as widespread as some believe it will.
And have my two dimes ready.
Peace.
Posted on 13-Oct-09 at 6:03 pm | PermalinkMr. Lamberti:
You already owe me a dime – less than 12 hours after my response to you. The U.S. government just gave the order to begin screening – and, if necessary, quarantining – airline passengers who show symptoms of the flu. Not only will they be taking temperatures, but people will be required to answer health-related questions. If they refuse, they can be quarantined with or without symptoms.
I told you the policy would broaden: and it has. Because it seems fairly obvious that anyone quarantined – or suspected of having swine flu symptoms – will not be permitted to enter (or leave) the U.S. without being vaccinated.
Watch this space for updates – which I am certain will be coming fast and furious.
As well, there is now at least one confirmed death from the vaccine: an 8-year-old boy died less than 24 hours after receiving the vaccine. He did not have any symptoms of swine flu, and there were no underlying medical conditions or complications. His obituary is in Monday’s issue of Newsday.
There is also an unconfirmed report of a 14-year-old girl also having died from the vaccine in the same township, again with no symptoms or complications. As I get more on this, I will post.
You can still rescind (or modify) your position if you wish.
Peace.
Posted on 13-Oct-09 at 10:35 pm | PermalinkMr. Lamberti:
Oops. Forgot one item. The CDC reports that there have been 36 swine flu deaths in the past week. They also estimate that there have been approximately 1,400 swine flu deaths in the U.S. since the first case in August 2008.
Compare this with the CDC’s estimate that, during a 140-day “normal” flu season, ~36,000 people die – a rate of ~1,800 per week. Yet I have seen no urgency in forced vaccinations for seasonal flu…
Food for thought.
Peace.
Posted on 13-Oct-09 at 10:39 pm | Permalink1.Your question is posed in manner that implies that the manufacturers of the H1N1 vaccine were given preferential treatment for some mysterious reason. I am quite certain that you are a well informed intelligent individual, so the following most likely contains information of which you are already well aware.
Posted on 14-Oct-09 at 12:08 am | PermalinkManufacturers of the H1N1 virus have immunity from tort liability according to the PREP act of 2006. The act states “The Public Readiness and Emergency Preparedness Act (“PREP Actâ€) enacted as Division C of the Defense Appropriations Act for fiscal year 2006, Pub. L. No. 109-148, added new authorities under the Public Health Service (PHS) Act to alleviate concerns about liability related to the manufacture, testing, development, distribution, administration and use of countermeasures against chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear agents of terrorism, epidemics, and pandemics.†H1N1 was classified as a pandemic, therefore vaccines for it can be covered under the act. Furthermore, the act states that “Immunity from liability is not available for death or serious physical injury caused by willful misconduct…â€. So your question is incomplete at best. I assume you will argue that “willful misconduct†would be difficult to prove. My simple answer to your question is that the manufacturers are covered under PREPA 2006. End of story.
That being said, if we are to buy into your theory we have to assume that a group of individuals, with hidden agendas, first drafted the PREP act of 2006, waited roughly three years to stage an H1N1 outbreak, colluded to create the illusion of a pandemic, thereby granting manufactures immunity from tort liability under PREPA, and then proceeded with the manufacture of the vaccine. This would have been quite an undertaking, and would have involved hundreds if not thousands of people working together over a period of years. Please correct me if I’m misinformed.
2.You must first take into account that a pandemic has nothing to do with mortality rates, it is rather a measure of how rapidly the disease spreads (i.e. a flu pandemic is marked by number of cases, not number of deaths). Do you suggest that we only vaccinate against diseases that will definitely cause death? The vaccine is meant to protect individuals from contracting the virus. Vaccination is being pushed more heavily because of the flu’s pandemic status. And although this flu is clearly not as deadly as other outbreaks, it could become more deadly if it continues to spread.
Again, as I stated in my initial comment, there is not enough vaccine to force vaccination of the entire population. Health care workers have long been encouraged to be vaccinated for measles, mumps, rubella, hepatitis A & B, varicella, tuberculosis, meningitis, pertussis, typhoid, and influenza. In a case of an epidemic or pandemic, I see it perfectly reasonable to require the mandatory vaccination of health care workers. Is this totalitarian? No. I will gladly don a tin foil hat and revolt if the government requires all citizens to be vaccinated, but until that happens I feel that you are overreacting. Perhaps workers should have a choice, like wearing a haz-mat suit to work instead of getting vaccinated. People who work in healthcare facilities, in the event of pandemic or epidemic, should be required to extra measures to protect patients. Are these people also “forced†to wear gloves and use disinfectant? And please enlighten me and explain what exactly the government has to gain by administering the vaccine?
Mr. Alterman,
Posted on 14-Oct-09 at 12:49 am | PermalinkQuarantine is certainly not a “broadening of the policyâ€. Quarantine is a measure that can be taken as seen fit by the CDC. It is and has been legal for most of recorded history. Current guidance from the CDC “Facts about Isolation and Quarantine†explains that “…The federal government derives its authority for isolation and quarantine from the Commerce Clause of the U.S. Constitution.
Under section 361 of the Public Health Service Act (42 U.S. Code § 264), the U.S. Secretary of Health and Human Services is authorized to take measures to prevent the entry and spread of communicable diseases from foreign countries into the United States and between states.
The authority for carrying out these functions on a daily basis has been delegated to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC).
Under 42 Code of Federal Regulations parts 70 and 71, CDC is authorized to detain, medically examine, and release persons arriving into the United States and traveling between states who are suspected of carrying these communicable diseases.
As part of its federal authority, CDC routinely monitors persons arriving at U.S. land border crossings and passengers and crew arriving at U.S. ports of entry for signs or symptoms of communicable diseases.
When alerted about an ill passenger or crew member by the pilot of a plane or captain of a ship, CDC may detain passengers and crew as necessary to investigate whether the cause of the illness on board is a communicable disease…â€
THIS IS NOT BY ANY MEANS A “BROADENING OF THE POLICYâ€. The quoted text is not an extract from a press release today. This is an extract from a guidance issued in December of 2007. You are providing misinformation! I just want to make sure I understand your logic. People are dying from the flu, be it H1N1 or seasonal. You don’t argue this fact. People are traveling with in large incubators (airplanes) with other people who can be infected and disbursed around the globe in a matter of hours. The CDC is trying to prevent this via the use of quarantine, a practice proven to inhibit the spread of disease. And this is a bad thing because…? Whose side are you on? At first I thought you were anti vaccine, now you seem to be pro-flu. Should people potentially infected with a deadly airborne disease be permitted to enter a plane and expose the passengers?
Mr. Lamberti:
Let me take your most recent comments one at a time.
Re the PREP Act, even if that were the only law covering the indemnity of the three drug companies that manufacture the H1N1 vaccine, I would simply add that it is bad law. (And no, I would never suggest it was created years in advance etc. I may distrust my government and Big Pharma in many ways, but that is truly over the top.) But you need to go back and re-read some of the articles (mainstream, not “conspiracy”) that make it clear that these companies were given ADDITIONAL immunity from prosecution. And you are correct: “willful misconduct” is difficult to prove. And you can bet that the pharmaceutical industry will fight any suggestion in that regard tooth and nail, even if there is substantial evidence for it.
You say, “The vaccine is being pushed more heavily because of the flu’s pandemic status.” Yet the seasonal flu is 10 TIMES more “pandemic” than H1N1, as proven by years and years of figures accumulated by CDC, WHO, etc. Thus, your argument here does not hold water.
You say there is “not enough vaccine to force vaccination on the entire population.” Once again, I suggest that you are willfully short-sighted in your timetable. As I said, let’s see where we are two, four, six months down the line – when there IS enough vaccine.
You say, “I see it perfectly reasonable to require the mandatory vaccination of health care workers.” But again, you ignore the facts. If the seasonal flu is 10 times more pandemic than H1N1, why has no mandatory vaccination ever been suggested for health care workers for THAT flu?
You then ask, “Is that totalitarian?” I will answer that in a moment.
You ask, “What exactly [does] the government have to gain by administering the vaccine?” That depends on how much you trust your government. I do not. Many do not. Many believe this is a test of both the vaccine itself (making humans into unwilling guinea pigs, without their consent) and stretching the boundaries of totalitarian practices in general.
Re quarantining, once again you ignore the facts about H1N1 vis-a-vis seasonal flu. There has never been a quarantining for seasonal flu, despite the fact that it kills TENS OF THOUSANDS MORE than H1N1. So please explain to me why H1N1 is being treated as if it is the bubonic plague.
Re my questioning of the quarantine, you ask, “Should people potentially infected with a deadly airborne disease be permitted to enter a plane and expose the passengers?” Are you joking?! This happens every single day, every time you get on a plane. It is an unavoidable fact of air travel. If we followed YOUR logic, we might as well test every single person getting onto every single plane in every single city in the world because one or more of them might be infected by a deadly airborne disease! Is that what YOU want? And no, this is not overreaction or silliness. It is fact.
You then ask, “Whose side are you on?” This brings us to the real question, doesn’t it? The one that ties in with your other question: “Is that totalitarian?”
The real question is: how far is one willing to allow one’s freedoms, rights, civil liberties and privacy to be minimized or curtailed in the name of (an often illusory or outright bogus) security, be it political or otherwise?
While I am certainly concerned about the spread of dangerous diseases, I simply do not believe that the alleged dangers associated with H1N1 (particularly in light of its comparison with seasonal flu) trump my personal freedom – or the freedom of health care workers, or anyone else – to reject the vaccine without fear of punishment or retribution of any type. If we were talking about bubonic or pneumonic plague – or some other disease which presented a REAL and serious danger – I would probably be more willing to allow my freedoms to be curtailed.
Finally, I thought you might find the article below of interest. Although I have not been able to verify the specific DETAILS of the report (i.e., actual # of sick and dead), there are enough similar reports of this incident in both mainstream and alternative press that there is no question that SOMETHING serious happened here, and it is being covered up as powerfully as can be.
Peace.
http://www.wral.com/golo/blogpost/6090277/
P.S. Perhaps ironically, today is Hannah Arendt’s birthday. In that regard, you might want to read her seminal work, The Origins of Totalitarianism. It is a real eye-opener.
Posted on 14-Oct-09 at 7:50 pm | PermalinkAlthough I would love to pick apart every comment you made (and I could) and argue all my points, I do unfortunately have a job (albeit far less entertaining and enjoyable than arguing with you). I’ll instead leave only this single comment.
Next time you feel inclined to start any sentence with, “Although I have not been able to verify the specific DETAILS…†you should instead, attempt to verify the specific details and revisit the subject once you yourself are adequately informed. That’s just a friendly suggestion, seeing as applying such logic would allow anyone to qualify a false statement as probable. For example, one could say, “Although I have not been able to verify the specific DETAILS of this statement, Ian Alterman is a conspiracy theorist who takes no time researching topics before commenting on them.†I know that is not a fair statement, but qualifying it by saying that I can’t prove it does not make it an acceptable statement. I mean you no disrespect, I’m just a smartass; and I do thoroughly enjoy arguing with someone with a matched mental aptitude and markedly different worldview, so please don’t take my comments as offensive.
Posted on 21-Oct-09 at 12:51 pm | Permalink-JL
First, I appreciate your kind comment at the end of your post, but it is (happily) not necessary: my skin is a tad thicker than that, so I don’t take things personally. (And I can also be something of a smart-ass at times – just ask Michael! LOL).
Re the “details” issue, I thought I had made clear that my point was not that that particular report – with those particular details – was true, but that I had seen a number of similar reports (from multiple sources) re a Navy ship and H1N1, to make me believe that the BASICS of that particular reports are true – or at least better than “probable.”
Re my “research,” although I do not take your comment personally (you swine! LOL), in actuality I probably do more research in these regards than most. However, since details can be scarce (or covered up), what I try to do is find as much material as possible on something, look for the common denominators, and determine as best I can which report (or what distillation of the entirety of the reports) is MOST LIKELY, since I accept that the “true story” in these types of cases is unlikely to be found, particularly if there is a deliberate cover-up.
Peace.
Posted on 21-Oct-09 at 5:56 pm | PermalinkFrom Mr. Alterman’s post 2 months ago: “Yes, right now it may only be some health care workers. But let’s see where we are two, four, six months from now if H1N1 becomes as widespread as some believe it will”. Just taking a friendly poll to see how many have had their forced vaccinations. Has the man paid you a visit Mr. Alterman? Have they come door to door with the vaccine? Has it been forced on you, or anyone else? Maybe they don’t have my address, but the forced vaccination crews have not made their way through my neighborhood yet. Don’t worry, I’m on the look out, and I’ll check in every 2 months. We’ve made it this far, and flu season will end eventually. Then we’ll have to be on the look out for the next big thing. My eyes are peeled.
Posted on 11-Dec-09 at 2:04 pm | PermalinkTrue, we are two months out. But only two months. Consider this from today’s NYT: “Federal health officials said Thursday that almost 10,000 people had died of swine flu since April, a significant jump from mortality numbers released last month. A month ago, the CDC estimated that only about 4,000 people had died…How many will ultimately die of the H1N1 flu depends heavily on whether there is a third wave in January, as happened in the 1918 and 1957 pandemics, and on whether the virus changes to be more lethal or drug-resistant.” One infectious disease expert is quoted as saying, “It’s amazing how many people are acting as if this is all wrapped up. The numbers could still go up dramatically.â€
So…they “underestimated” by more than 100%?! Not likely. This, coupled with the expectation of a “third wave” – and comments like that of the disease expert – gives plenty of opportunity for the suggestion about mass (and possibly forced) vaccination to come true.
Again, we are, indeed, two months out. And two months out (i) the CDC is claiming a 150% underestimation of swine flu deaths (something which none of us can prove or disprove), (ii) the CDC is suggesting a “third wave” of the virus next year, and (iii) an infectious disease specialist is suggesting the number of cases could still rise “dramatically.”
But as you correctly quote me, I say, “Let’s see where we are two, four six months from now.” Let’s see where we are at my original four or six month point.
Peace.
Posted on 11-Dec-09 at 3:17 pm | Permalink